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The Punisher: WarZone


Tim Bradstreet
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Hey, we made it to 100 pages! - Formerly 100, now after edits this is officially 99 ;(

Even with all the posts that have been deleted prior!

 

I'm honestly trying to decide whether or not to delete some of the most recent ones.

I was hoping to answer to Kevin's bomb without all the non-helpful, though well intended slew of "fuckwit", "IDIOT", "asshole", and "fucking moron" comments.

This is the very thing that doesn't help, it only feeds the fire. I'm sure it makes good reading though ;)

I'm sorry to see threats of violence whether sarcastic or otherwise surface here as well.

I mentioned this not being "high school" earlier. Let's please try and leave that angle back there.

 

Any thoughts on deleting posts? What do you bunch think?

Is any of this constructive enough to leave?

 

Forum Edit - The question is now moot - The thread has now been edited from page 97 thru 99.

Thanks for your patience.

 

- TB

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Also - I just went over to the GPA site because I'm terrible at suppressing my curiosity.

I can't remember my login and password so I couldn't view the forum.

I did however see the video they put together (did Kevin do this?).

I have to say that parts of it are very compelling.

I think their heart is in the right place. I'm just not convinced that Gale is the demon they are trying to make her out to be.

Too many other players involved to place ire squarely on her. Apparently Gale is the one who has been elected to oversee the changes but this had to have been a group decision.

The vid makes a lot of assumptions as to the Lexi cut.

I'd be interested to know for sure how much truth there is to the movie being cut down to the extent that the vid reports.

I'm only assuming here too, but aren't they still re-editing? That vid appeared when?

 

I'll say it again. I think it sucks when an artist is pulled off a project. My heart goes out to Lexi on that note.

I want to see whatever is missing as much as the rest of you. Maybe GPA's efforts will help force that to eventually happen on DVD.

Then we would actually be able to judge these events for ourselves fully.

 

- TB

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Any thoughts on deleting posts? What do you bunch think?

Is any of this constructive enough to leave?

 

- TB

 

I think most of us are thick skinned, but I see no reason if anyone is that upset not to pull the posts. Stuff like this is going to happen again, no matter how frustrating it is. I would like to bring this to attention though; I'm not pointing fingers, I just think everyone got caught up in the moment, and as you said Tim, the ante was upped in several posts.

 

From the GPA boards registration page:

 

You agree, through your use of this forum, that you will not post any material which is false, defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, adult material, or otherwise in violation of any International or United States Federal law.

 

 

From Tim himself:

 

This is RAW, we don't like rules.

However, without a certain few ground type rules we would have to call ourselves "CHAOS", not RAW.

Check the rules, abide by them, and we call you friend.

Throw caution into the wind and test us and we'll ace you, it's that simple.

 

1. No multiple memberships on the same IP. This is the classic Troll move. If there is a legit reason let me know. Otherwise, out you go.

 

2. No personal attacks on the RAW management or other members. Things can get heated, and if it's in the proper spirit it will be allowed, but if you are acting like a Jackass because you can hide behind a screen name, your belligerence will be repaid in kind. Just think about it before you post it.

 

3. Language - We're all for freedom of speech here, so if an expletive is called for, feel free. But if you get personal, please refer to Rule #2. Trolls will not be tolerated.

 

If you feel you've been banned unjustly, please post your thoughts as a guest, here in "Site Feedback and Announcements".

 

See? Simple.

I hope I don't have to add more.

It's wait and see.

 

Thank you brothers and sisters.

 

- TB

 

Like I said, everyone just got caught up. We all know by now we will never full agree, but we have to keep in mind that this is a community.

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It sure was fun though. :) Let me vent a bit...expend some hostility...and I didn't even threaten to beat up or shoot anyone. :)

 

Fred

 

I still cant believe it got to that LOL! if this were a school campus ...Whoever it was that said he was gonna shoot someone with a shotgun would have a bad case of expulsion right now.

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Forum Edit Tim... did you see anything LG passed along about Lexi, to character assassination sites like IESB.net, Joe Drake's chief minions? That her film was a trainwreck, that Gale Anne Hurd was saving it from disaster, that the dialogue was unimaginable?

 

Dialogue was unimaginable.

 

Hmm, could that have anything to do with the script. ;)

 

Sorry guys late night madness - couldn't help myself.

 

Andrew

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I hate these internet wars. If you have something to say to somebody, say it to their face. If it's something you wouldn't say to their face, then don't hide behind a computer and say it. Also, I'm from Canada as well, and I never even fired a gun before, except for a bb gun. If I had to use violence(and I had to before, no big surprise) I use my bare hands, that's how I was raised.

 

I think that War zone will not be released straight to dvd, and I think it will be released to a good number of theatre's, which is where I will see it. If it doesn't do well, that sucks, but it's just a movie, so I won't kill myself over it.

 

I know this is off topic, but TB, have you seen the dark knight? I just seen it for the 2nd time the other day, and it's my new favorite movie. What did everyone else think?

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Guest AdminGuyX

Dude, we have a Dark Knight thread in the films section.

 

I was raised in Northern Michigan. I'm practically canadian. I try to behave online as I do in my everyday life, has nothing to do with where I was born.

 

I think threats online are weak and pointless. I thnk threats -anywhere- are weak and pointless.

 

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Guest FADoss

The closest I get to a threat is this and this goes for anyone, anytime, anywhere. If you want it, bring it. ONE of us will end up hurt. When I'm mad enough to fight I'm a psychopath. I lose it...and I don't windmill punch. All I've ever learned how to do in fighting is REALLY hurt people. I've never done tournament arts...tried to do Aikido...and what do you know was bored to tears.

 

Bottom line, I know how to hurt people and if pushed will fight until I hurt you or you hurt me. Online, anything I've ever said regarding physical violence is in response to "I'm going to beat you up" comments. On that note, my response is bring it and we'll find out.

 

I will be the FIRST to admit, that my tact level on the net is WAY lower than in person. Talking to TL on the phone, I can say the same for him. Our conversations on the phone are MUCH more restrained, constructive and filled with polite disagreements and limited digging. In person, we'd probably be bossom buddies and take on the world. On here, we call each other stupid and say really nasty things.

 

It links back to an article of psychology dealing with the mask...and one's ability to do really crappy stuff when you have anonymity. To quote Kevin Bacon in Hollow Man "It's amazing what you can do when you don't have to look at yourself in the mirror anymore." So, people degenerate in the cyber world.

 

I can PERSONALLY vouch for Noeland in that whether it's online, on the phone or in person you get Noeland...not a reduced form. I assume by his civil postings that Tim is the same way (we've yet to chat outside of the net). Sadly, I get reduced to a bit of a dick...

 

Fred

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Also - I just went over to the GPA site because I'm terrible at suppressing my curiosity.

I can't remember my login and password so I couldn't view the forum.

I did however see the video they put together (did Kevin do this?).

I have to say that parts of it are very compelling.

I think their heart is in the right place. I'm just not convinced that Gale is the demon they are trying to make her out to be.

Too many other players involved to place ire squarely on her. Apparently Gale is the one who has been elected to oversee the changes but this had to have been a group decision.

The vid makes a lot of assumptions as to the Lexi cut.

I'd be interested to know for sure how much truth there is to the movie being cut down to the extent that the vid reports.

I'm only assuming here too, but aren't they still re-editing? That vid appeared when?

 

I'll say it again. I think it sucks when an artist is pulled off a project. My heart goes out to Lexi on that note.

I want to see whatever is missing as much as the rest of you. Maybe GPA's efforts will help force that to eventually happen on DVD.

Then we would actually be able to judge these events for ourselves fully.

 

- TB

 

No one is going to turn their attacks on you....hahhaha Kev may have a personal beef and thats fine....but there isnt gonna be a rally at the flag pole and show down at sun down...

 

I wanna say this before you read any more of my post...or people wanna start something over nothing....Sometimes you cant just speak to people...sometimes you gotta smack them in the face with a brick to get them to listen...

 

The punisher community is divided.....its all over the web...there is no central location to gather all the troops to rally behind something....I respect the fuck out of Kevin for making an effort to get everyone behind the cause.....He personally has taken beatings all over the internet and insults for trying to do something...anything to save this movie....and people with common ground kick him in the fucking balls for it....The man keeps marching on...

 

You may not like the our style of fighting....you may find it petty....you may even think our information isnt correct....you are all entitled to that...we have a purpose....we have a reason....there is a method I promise you....and I believe its working....its funny that you say things that we dont know these people or it may be slanderous or whatever then turn around in the same breath and lump us all as morons or pussies or whatever the fuck you all think is clever....we are trying, what have you done???

 

Tim, you gotta start somewhere....and if that means making a demon, so be it.....I find a conflict of interest...you may not....but the 04 movie is pretty bad....and sometimes just sometimes the devil you dont know, may just be an angel....I dont want this movie in the same hands of people I know 100% have already made a "trainwreck".....I dont think the slander towards lexi alexander is justified....she has been as great to the fans as you have over the years.....just like the dudes of this site have yours and TJ's back....I have kevins and lexi/ray's.....

 

I cant speak for kevin, but it feels like a disappointment that other pillars in this community dont speak out....you probably do know a thing or two that I dont....all the fans ask for is a little love and support....all we want is a movie that does our boy justice....

 

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I side with "get rid of the bullshit", scrape it clean, mostly because it has NOTHING TO DO WITH THE ACTUAL THREAD.

 

Noeland, next time you are here we're goin' to TIM HORTONS' and eat a ton'o jelly doughnuts aye? And then we'll watch Strange Brew like 8 times in a row.

 

And that's NOT making fun of Canadians! I love jelly doughnuts and Strange Brew is one of my favorite comedies...clarification, to avoid shots to the face.

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You may not like the our style of fighting....you may find it petty....you may even think our information isnt correct....you are all entitled to that...we have a purpose....we have a reason....there is a method I promise you....and I believe its working....its funny that you say things that we dont know these people or it may be slanderous or whatever then turn around in the same breath and lump us all as morons or pussies or whatever the fuck you all think is clever....we are trying, what have you done???

 

I can attest my vulgarities toward Kevin came more from him coming here and insulting people. Even though I think what you guys are doing for the most part is bullshit, that had nothing to do with whatever I called him.

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Guest AdminGuyX

OK, where do I even start?

 

I cant speak for kevin, but it feels like a disappointment that other pillars in this community dont speak out....you probably do know a thing or two that I dont....all the fans ask for is a little love and support....all we want is a movie that does our boy justice....

 

And you think you are doing that?

 

Speaking out is one thing. Leveling a negative, personal angry campaign at a someone because you're mad about something is quite another. It's counter productive, and makes the fanbase look immature and crazy. As a fan of The Punisher, I am disappointed in what you are doing. Very disappointed.

 

I can only hope people don't think what you are about is what all Punisher fans are about.

 

we are trying, what have you done???

 

Are you KIDDING me? He's defined the character for this generation, that's what he's done.

 

What you are doing is not "trying" anything. It's destructive in so many ways.

 

Sometimes you cant just speak to people...sometimes you gotta smack them in the face with a brick to get them to listen...

 

So, you and TL feel the same about that, OK. I disagree. You can always speak to people, ALWAYS. But then it's their choice to listen, or not listen, and smacking them with a brick is your disrespectful and selfish way of dealing with them ignoring you. It's NOT how to make people listen, it's how you destroy your own credibility and soil your own message.

 

Not to mention, the film hasn't been released, and you have no idea what we're getting. Removing Lexi might have been what was NEEDED to do our boy justice. You have no idea what's going on.

 

He personally has taken beatings all over the internet and insults for trying to do something...anything to save this movie....and people with common ground kick him in the fucking balls for it....The man keeps marching on...

 

He's taking beatings all over the internet because he's going and picking fights like he did here? Oh that's real impressive. Gimme a break. Do you really think this is admirable what you're doing? You know better. You know exactly what this is. A big internet temper tantrum.

 

No one is going to turn their attacks on you....hahhaha Kev may have a personal beef and thats fine....but there isnt gonna be a rally at the flag pole and show down at sun down...

 

Maybe you got carried away with your own crusade later in the post, but the rest of your post doesn't jive with this idealogy.

 

You're coming off like you're on a grand quest after posting:

 

people wanna start something over nothing

 

Is it something, or is it nothing?

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Dialogue was unimaginable.

 

Hmm, could that have anything to do with the script. ;)

 

Sorry guys late night madness - couldn't help myself.

 

Andrew

 

No, that seems about right though. Reading the script none of the dialouge really popped out for me it was either cheesy, bland or was just filled with fucks, well actually there was one line towards the end that made me chuckle, even though the scene is kinda anti-climatic. And there were a couple of bits, that didn't really seem like stuff the Punisher would say too.

 

As much of a "trainwreck" the last movie may or may not have been, I thought it at least had some nice dialouge in there.

 

Frank Castle: Howard Saint. Howard Saint!

Frank Castle: You took everything from me.

Howard Saint: You killed my son.

John Saint: No!

Frank Castle: Both of them.

 

Accountant #1: You know whose money this is? You know whose building this is?

Frank Castle: Howard Saint's.

Accountant #2: He's gonna fuck your life up.

Frank Castle: He already fucked my life up.

 

I can go on. But I won't.

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Owenstar - I do appreciate your bringing your thoughts here. Even toned and sincere.

 

No one is going to turn their attacks on you....hahhaha Kev may have a personal beef and thats fine....but there isnt gonna be a rally at the flag pole and show down at sun down...

 

That's nice to hear. I was afraid it might turn uglier, and the last thing Punisher fans need to be doing is slamming each other on masse. More below.

 

I wanna say this before you read any more of my post...or people wanna start something over nothing....Sometimes you cant just speak to people...sometimes you gotta smack them in the face with a brick to get them to listen...

 

The punisher community is divided.....its all over the web...there is no central location to gather all the troops to rally behind something....I respect the fuck out of Kevin for making an effort to get everyone behind the cause.....He personally has taken beatings all over the internet and insults for trying to do something...anything to save this movie....and people with common ground kick him in the fucking balls for it....The man keeps marching on...

 

Well, as I mentioned, I think his heart is in the right place, it's the method, the venom towards certain individuals that takes the legitimacy away from the fight.

If folks that are on common ground with him are kicking him in the balls for it then maybe that's a sign that he should give his strategy a second thought?

 

You may not like the our style of fighting....you may find it petty....you may even think our information isnt correct....you are all entitled to that...we have a purpose....we have a reason....there is a method I promise you....and I believe its working....its funny that you say things that we dont know these people or it may be slanderous or whatever then turn around in the same breath and lump us all as morons or pussies or whatever the fuck you all think is clever....we are trying, what have you done???

 

Well the question many of us are asking is, are you really so sure that something should be done? This is what I spoke to earlier in regards to assumption.

The Lexi cut may be longer, but is the consensus so positive that a longer cut makes it a better film? I certainly do not know because I've seen neither cut. There is no question of an artist being removed from the project. This is an unfortunate fact. But whether or not this move was warranted is the real question.

As to the name calling, I think a lot of that was precipitated by Kevin's initial comments yesterday here at the board, or in response to the personal attack on Gale/Jonathan. In this equation, Kevin would seem to speak for the GPA at large. So in effect he would be the one that lumped you all together in the first place.

Generalizing is a by-product. Take those comments personally if you feel they apply to you. But if they do not apply then one would hope you would not be offended.

Also, it is my hope that we've moved beyond the name calling and can now speak constructively.

 

Tim, you gotta start somewhere....and if that means making a demon, so be it.....I find a conflict of interest...you may not....but the 04 movie is pretty bad....and sometimes just sometimes the devil you dont know, may just be an angel....I dont want this movie in the same hands of people I know 100% have already made a "trainwreck".....I dont think the slander towards lexi alexander is justified....she has been as great to the fans as you have over the years.....just like the dudes of this site have yours and TJ's back....I have kevins and lexi/ray's.....

 

Having your friend's backs is admirable. But please try and understand that by and large this board is mostly respectful of Lexi/Ray. I think it's pretty cool that we have the opportunity and the freedom to speak our minds both pro and con with respect to this film on Tom Jane's own forum, without having to feel like we should suppress ourselves out of respect for the actor who is no longer a part of this franchise. Tom has given us the latitude to speak openly. He may be against this film for personal reasons, but he has never made his forum a place for organized anti Warzone sentiment. As fans we want to see a good Punisher film as much as the next person.

 

I guess I just don't agree with Kevin's ideology, and the assumption that because Hensleigh is out of the loop this must mean that Gale is trying to pole-axe the film in some bizarre attempt to stand by her man. I've spoken to this before and that assumption is ludicrous. I know for a fact that Jonathan has moved on. Gale has moved on. Valhalla's connection to this franchise is purely business. And they wouldn't be in business very long if their business was to sabotage their own films. I can't even believe we're discussing this angle. I do think it's admirable for the fans to stand behind Lexi, to help fight for her vision. I just can't get behind the tactics. I know everyone wants to deify someone with respect to recent events, but I also think that fandom itself can cloud one's judgement. People are so caught up in the fervor, the drama, the hanging on every word or scrap of information that comes to light. Sometimes we miss the forest for the trees mate.

 

I cant speak for kevin, but it feels like a disappointment that other pillars in this community dont speak out....you probably do know a thing or two that I dont....all the fans ask for is a little love and support....all we want is a movie that does our boy justice....

 

The community does speak out. I myself have spoken out about certain things, as a fan and as a professional. And whenever you do that you run the risk of coming under fire. That's fine, it comes with the territory. On this subject I've said what I believe. I see no good reason for an extreme point of view. I was not there when Lexi allegedly did what LGF claims she did. I wasn't there to see her assembly of the film. How can I weigh in fully on a subject I know nothing about? I do not, nor do any of us know if the decision to move forward without Lexi is warranted or not. There is as much a chance of Lexi's film being rubbish as there is of it being the brilliant magnum opus that some suppose or hope for. The only fact I can reasonably see at this point in time is that we on the outside do not know. It's great to have a cause worth fighting for but as far as I can see most of this crusade for Lexi's vision is based solely on surface information. The general facts. I take no sides here because there just simply isn't enough concrete evidence to support the fight one way or the other.

 

- TB

 

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I meant to post this last night, but didn't get around to it.

 

Here is Clive Barker's letter to his fans about what LGF did to Midnight Meat Train (which, as I mentioned before, is getting good reviews).

 

This letter was published in 'Fangoria'

 

"Hello my friends,

 

Clive Barker here. I wish I could be with you in the flesh to talk with you, but I’ve got a battle on my hands here in Los Angeles. So Tony’s kindly agreed to share this letter to you.

 

To be perfectly honest, I need your help: As you may know, last year I was the executive producer of a movie from one of my BOOKS OF BLOOD stories, called THE MIDNIGHT MEAT TRAIN. Ryuhei Kitamura directed it and he did a superb job. The film is scary, stylish and very violent, which is just fine by me. I’m very proud of it.

 

But there have been signs for a long while that Lionsgate, the company releasing the movie, was going to screw around with it. Release dates were changed and changed again. And my phone calls to the people at Lionsgate, asking for answers, were not returned.

 

I was finally told that Lionsgate only planned to open the movie in a tiny number of theaters—somewhere between 100 and 300—run it for a week, then put it on DVD.

 

In other words, they were going to dump our movie.

 

This has nothing to do with the quality of our picture. In fact, it is happening to a number of other movies in Lionsgate’s hands, many of which were guided into production by a great friend of horror movies, Peter Block, who left the company several months ago.

 

It was his exit that caused our present situation. A new man, Joe Drake, replaced Peter Block and—as happens so often in Hollywood—I believe he decided to trash all the projects Peter Block had supported.

 

It seems not to matter that a lot of very talented men and women sweated to create this picture—knowing that all the horror fans who see it, will love it. It’s being dumped because of company politics. Simple as that.

 

So…

 

I’m fighting back.

 

And I’m asking you now to fight with me.

 

If you want to see THE MIDNIGHT MEAT TRAIN on the big screen the way it should be seen, please contact Joe Drake at Lionsgate and tell him your feelings.

 

Here’s how to do it:

 

You can contact Joe Drake directly at jdrake@lionsgate.com or call the main switchboard at Lionsgate, which is (310) 449-9200, and ask for Joe Drake’s office. You can also get the information from my official website, which is www.clivebarker.info.

 

Please be polite in your protest. We don’t want to worsen the situation by making our attacks personal.

 

Thank you all so much for listening and thank you for supporting my books and films over the years. I promise to try to keep bringing you the best work I can do.

 

Finally, let me thank you in advance for helping us to get THE MIDNIGHT MEAT TRAIN running to our fans across America.

 

My love to you,

 

And best wishes,

 

As always,

 

Clive"

 

If Drake does this to MMT, then who knows what else he'll do to PWZ and the other 15 films that under consideration for dumping. People might say that the GPA is being vindictive, but so is this Drake guy, if he's fucking over 17 films just to make his predecessor look bad.

 

And this letter isn't by just some fan. It's by Cliver Barker, the author of the original story, and a producer on the film.

 

Unfortunately, Barker wasn't able to stop the dumping of the film, and it got stuck in a hundred small-town dollar theaters spread throughout America.

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Thanks for this Arsh!

 

I meant to post this last night, but didn't get around to it.

 

Here is Clive Barker's letter to his fans about what LGF did to Midnight Meat Train (which, as I mentioned before, is getting good reviews).

 

Go Clive!!!!

 

 

People might say that the GPA is being vindictive, but so is this Drake guy, if he's fucking over 17 films just to make his predecessor look bad.

 

So what not take the fight to Drake?

 

- TB

 

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No, that seems about right though. Reading the script none of the dialouge really popped out for me it was either cheesy, bland or was just filled with fucks, well actually there was one line towards the end that made me chuckle, even though the scene is kinda anti-climatic. And there were a couple of bits, that didn't really seem like stuff the Punisher would say too.

 

As much of a "trainwreck" the last movie may or may not have been, I thought it at least had some nice dialouge in there.

 

Frank Castle: Howard Saint. Howard Saint!

Frank Castle: You took everything from me.

Howard Saint: You killed my son.

John Saint: No!

Frank Castle: Both of them.

 

Accountant #1: You know whose money this is? You know whose building this is?

Frank Castle: Howard Saint's.

Accountant #2: He's gonna fuck your life up.

Frank Castle: He already fucked my life up.

 

I can go on. But I won't.

 

What I found so amusing about the post was that it implied that bad dialogue was such a surprise. As I've said several times you can't make a good film out of a bad script. The irony is that people are then attacking TJ for the fact that he left the project because of the low quaility of the screenplay. Seems like no solid foundation to the argument.

 

The art of writing dialogue is a subtle and yet complicated process. You need to be able to layer characterisations and subtext with a minimal amount of words. Each line of dialogue should reveal more about character without resorting to exposition. Hensleigh's screenplay is a strong example of that.

 

People also seem oblivious to the realisation that film is a collobarative medium which ultimulately results in continued compromise. Budget and shooting schedule define screenplay structure and execution. Story may need to shift locale in order to the project justice or keep the calibre of the story as focus.

 

We live in such a hypcoricy of film that it is okay to have a dozen different writers working on a screenplay and then discard them at a moments notice. They are after all writers-for-hire. Yet when the same thing happens to a director-for-hire everyone is up in arms.

 

Simplified if it ain't on the page, it ain't going to be on the screen - period. The film was lost from that moment forward.

 

I'm all open to discussion on the merits of one versus the other but reducing it to slander and insults is petty. Then I guess you can view Frank Castle in two forms - as a guy who fucks people up and from the level of dialogue on these recent posts that may make him some people's idol. Or you can view Castle as a complicated character scowling the underbelly of the urban jungle.

 

I know which one I'd pay money to see and Warzone isn't it.

 

Andrew

 

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Guest AdminGuyX

It's a VERY common practice when management changes hands, that movies get dumped and the companies slate of films in development changes drastically.

 

Now that I know about this, everything makes sense. Gale is trying to SAVE PWZ from being dumped and shit on, I god damn guarantee you.

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In the letter from Clive, he makes a very good point, that being not to make personal attacks. Seriously, if this thing is done on the internet, why go to the sites, or even read the e-mails if all they are filled with vulgar attacks. Click, delete, message not taken. Like Gale or Joe even care about most of the shit on the net anyway. They make insane amounts of money and like they care about someones opinion who is bashing and that they will never meet. I don't think they have been loosing any sleep.

 

Take Clive's advise, do things courteous and constructive. They might just listen.

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Guest FADoss

Wow...fighting the good fight with a website. Waging WAR against the powers that be...and doing WHAT exactly to fix anything.

 

Let's examine a few facts:

 

1.) Hurd works for someone else. Someone who wants to make MONEY. If she were intentionally fucking up the film to make it unmarketable that would be a highly STUPID move and counter to MAKING MONEY. There is no way she would TANK the film to allow her husband an "I told you so". It doesn't make sense. And people who have worked on as many films as she has get results...or they get poor.

 

2.) IF this film tanks, it doesn't get another chance... Do you understand that? I mean, your protesting and negativity at best will KILL the film franchise. You WANT this movie to do well in any form. You may be critical about Hurd's comments, BUT if it fails...no one is going to care who's fault it was...only that it did not make money.

 

3.) There is a HUGE assumption that Lexi's cut of the film was good enough! There is some basis for this based on previous track record, but let's not leap too far to conclusions.

 

4.) HENSLEIGH's own film lost lots of footage with his supposedly biased WIFE at the producers helm. Many people have talked about how much better it would have been had it been left alone. I believe that even the Extended film is not HIS final vision of the film. Where is the special treatment?

 

5.) Soundtracks featuring heavy metal SELL... look at The Crow in particular...and a slew of other soundtracks (such as Scream 3) that had excellent soundtracks that made mucho dinero in their own right. For all those out there not paying attention, filmmaking is a business. And when scoring an ultraviolent film like this you have a potential to score big with an ultraviolent soundtrack. Every testosterone engorged freak who goes to see this and enjoys it will be buying the soundtrack...and THAT is money in the bank.

 

There is SO much more. Now does all this mean Hurd is making the RIGHT decisions...not necessarily. BUT it is not nearly as crappy as everyone is indicating right now.

 

SO, my advice is SIT down, wait till December and see what we get. You are NOT GOING TO AFFECT THE FINAL CUT OF THIS FILM WITH A CHILDISH WEBSITE MAKING FUN OF A PRODUCER'S HAIR CUT. Fourth grade antics like that are unprofessional and not productive.

 

AND you are not doing ANYTHING for the future of Punisher films by supporting the failure of this one.

 

Fred

 

Made a tiny edit Fred, my apologies. - TB

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2.) IF this film tanks, it doesn't get another chance... Do you understand that? I mean, your protesting and negativity at best will KILL the film franchise. You WANT this movie to do well in any form. You may be critical about Hurd's comments, BUT if it fails...no one is going to care who's fault it was...only that it did not make money.

 

Fred

 

Well, if it tanks it doesn't get another chance for a while. But never say never ;)

And the protesting will at worst "KILL the film franchise", though I doubt GPA's Truth has that kind of power. At best it will get people interested enough to see what all the fuss is about come December 5th.

 

- TB

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I dont know the ins and outs of your boards to make the quotes and shit work.....bear with me....

 

 

I am also not the eloquent or elegant speaker, I was never on the debate team....Being Italian I speak with my hands....and am much better at getting my point across in person...

 

Mike V...Thanks for your opinion! I cant change your mind, got nothing more to talk about I guess....

 

Noeland,

 

I have been around this community along time....and the majority is immature and crazy....I see what we are doing as no different than what has been done to lexi alexander....and I firmly believe in fight fire with fire.....I am sorry to disappoint you, and I mean that...but the community has disappointed me as a whole.....we opened the doors to lead the charge and asked for suggestions....I wished people would have stepped to the plate....they didnt....leave my ass to my own devices, hahahaha...

 

The what have you done isnt/wasnt directed at tim.....its for everyone!

 

My "credibility" with people on the web I dont know doesnt really interest me....Again your opinion is that its silly (among the other things you have to say) but its working....just because the few people here and there havent show support, our site hits are up....my message and email boxes are full....the petition is signed....people are responding...sometimes its hard to take yourself away from your personal opinion on it...but those are facts....we have support and we know what we are doing....

 

You also have no idea what I have seen or what I base my information on.....I cant run all over the internet screaming where I heard what or if I have seen the film or most of it....no dont read between the lines...I am just stating you dont know what I know...

 

I think it jived just fine....I wasnt attacking tim or any of you at any point...

 

This is something to me....

 

I appreciate the respectful response

 

Tim,

 

While the current situation may make it seem like we are extremists, it isnt the case I promise!

 

Read the above for the strategy.....We welcomed options with open arms....our way isnt everyones cup of tea....I respect that....but we wouldnt be who we are without it...

 

I dont think I named called.....but while I can understand your reasoning behind thinking it must be more than personal vendetta, I am sure some of it is....but reasonable people look past the simple things and toss them aside as not probable....I've done it....But we are all human and we all act and behave in strange ways sometimes.....we would like to think people in positions of power are beyond the petty....that isnt the case sir, catch much of the Brett Farve saga? He isnt the new managements guy...they treat him like dirt....this is just a small example in the public eye....these things happen in large business and corporations much less slimey than hollywood....aint hard for me to believe it could all be something so petty....(I dont mean this as a slam in any way) but if TJ can speak negatively in public about this movie, isnt that basic human nature? He was slighted, so he speaks out about it....it is petty on some level isnt it? He is done and should have moved on, but alas he is just a man like you and I....

 

I never had any intention on slamming TJ, I was one of his most vocal supporters during filming...after and forever....I saw stander....The Punisher fans really got behind him.....A lot of guys still are.....Frank Castle brings nothing if not loyalty....

 

Like I said, I just trust the devil I dont know.....It may not be a masterpiece.....but it was made with heart and passion....just like Tom gave us....

 

 

even toned has never been used to describe me....hahahaha I am usually the fly off the handle fuckin asshole....but like I said this is a community of people who I like and respect....and who I share common ground with.....thanks to every one for being cool....

 

Fadoss, your post came up while I was typing....lets chat later...

 

PS....we must be making a dent since someone is paying close enough attention to try and shut us down!!!!

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No, no one is trying to shut you down or anything, do the petitions, and e-mail Joe Drake, that's all fine no harm no foul there. It's just calling you guys out on the rest of the bullshit. The conspiracy theories and the scapegoating, from information that is frankly unreliable, IESB and Ain't It Cool News aren't exactly the beacons of credibility, IESB most of all.

 

You're claiming to have all this information, when again it's unreliable. One day it's she was kicked off the film, the next she's only going to be consultant and recently it's all been done for publicity.

 

 

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