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Tim Bradstreet

The Punisher: WarZone

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Here are some shots of what Frank Castle should look like... He's a REAL person and not something that belongs in a graphic novel.

 

He is a comic book character. The best one ever, but a comic book character nonetheless. He's not real, and that's great, because it allows everyone who reads the book to have their own personal interpretation of him. That's the best thing about Frank Castle, everyone has their own view of who the character is, and these interpretations range from mass murdering psychopath to tortured tragic hero and so on. And because we get such a wide variety of interpretations, he is not a character that remains static. That's the hallmark of a great character that you can take the character and view him through so many different lens and view points, like a real person. Real people are stuck in just one view point. Every one looks at everyone else in their own way and through their own lens. The same goes for the films, all three of them. Each one has their own separate interpretation and spin on Frank Castle, and I think that's great. He's not a character that should be just pigeon-holed into whatever spot you think he is.

 

 

 

 

Hey, maybe they could do THIS movie! :)

punisher.jpg

 

 

 

I would go on a mass murder spree if that was ever put to film... that was fucking terrible that series... I wish they hadn't done that to The Punisher. But at least we got Garth Ennis after that and he made things right.

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According to LionsGate film Ray is Frank Castle. Nothing we can do or say to change that. I damn near cried when I heard Tom dropped out. He had to do what he had to do though. When I was a kid my brother introduced me to the Punisher. I was 1 when the first Punisher movie came out with Dolph. It happened to be my favorite movie right next to the Indiana Jones series. I thought it was a movie and not a comic book. Then my brother showed me all the comics and stuff. I have every single Punisher comic book since his very first appearance. All originals. I thought as a kid that Dolph was a fantastic actor. I thought he was the perfect Punisher. What the hell did I know as a fuckin toddler? I saw a big guy killing people and I saw explosions and I loved it. Till this day I still love the '89 version of the film because it did a lot for me as a child. When I heard that Artisan greenlit The Punisher, I was excited. For some fuckin reason I wanted Dolph back though. It just stuck with me. I wasn't sure how well Tom would do. I wasn't familiar enough with his work. Then I saw the teaser trailer for the movie and I thought "Well, I'm gonna need a little more than that to be convinced". Not many people enjoyed the teaser trailer for the movie. Then I saw one picture and felt the same way. Then I saw another, and then another and then another. I then said to myself "This is the fuckin Punisher!". I'm sure it's gonna happen to me and many others again once more pictures and a trailer is released. Only thing I can say is "We'll see what happens". By the way, Tom is a little taller than 5'10". More like 5'11" give or take centimeter. He weighed about 200 pounds during production and that to me was another great Punisher build. For the past 33 years, Castle has had different artists, different shapes, different sizes. Dolph, Tom, and Ray all fit in with the Punisher one way or another. To me, they are all the Punisher. In the future if there is another Punisher movie made in a rebooted format, I'm sure that the actor casted will fit the description as well. TL are you telling me that when Hugh Jackman was cast as Wolverine that everyone was ecstatic about it? You look at Logan, a 5'3"-5'6", 230 pound maniac. Then you look at Hugh Jackman, a 6'2, 180 pound Aussie theatre actor. He hit the gym listening to Metallica and Godsmack, he read the comics, he put on an accent, and he went to work. I personally thought that Russell Crowe was the man to be casted but it was Hugh Jackman and he fuckin rocked the silver screen. Wolverine is a Candian not an Australian right? So I certainly mean no disrespect to you in any way shape or form sir, but I think most people would agree that you're being hypocritical. I'm being a civil person here and you are more than welcome to your own opinion and I very much respect it. I'm just saying that everyone should have an open mind and not judge too soon.

 

Raffi

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The same way Lucas and Spielberg waited for a script that would attract Harrison Ford - NEVER did they even consider recasting Indy. Punisher II, could have been the bloodbath with a soul we ALL wanted. Unfortunately for us, we got the bloodbath - but we lost Frank.

 

According to Wikipedia, you're wrong:

 

Originally, Spielberg suggested Harrison Ford; Lucas resisted the idea, since he had already cast the actor in three of his movies (American Graffiti, Star Wars, and its sequel The Empire Strikes Back), and did not want Ford to become known as his "Bobby De Niro" (in reference to the fact that fellow director Martin Scorsese regularly cast Robert De Niro in his films).[5] During an intensive casting process, Lucas and Spielberg auditioned many actors, and finally cast then little-known actor Tom Selleck as Indiana Jones. Shortly afterward pre-production began in earnest on Raiders of the Lost Ark.[5]

 

However, CBS refused to release Selleck from his contractual commitment to Magnum, P.I. (which was gradually gaining momentum in the ratings), forcing him to turn down the role.[5] After Spielberg suggested Ford again, Lucas finally capitulated, and he was cast in the role — less than 3 weeks before principal photography began.[5]

 

What would have been:

 

Tom_3.jpg

 

But then by your reasoning, if you look at the comic books over it's 30 year history, you can simply exclude any version of Frank simply because it doesn't fit your view point.

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TL, you think that Artisan cared too much about the '04 film? If they did they woulda gave Hensleigh a bigger budget than 15 million dollars don't you think? Movies that bombed have recieved over a hundred million dollars. I wished for sequel to Tom's version. Too little, too late. We can't live in the past cause if we do, we won't ever see a future. What's done is done. If it were up to me, I woulda sodl the rights of the character to a different production company and taken my time with it. Fuckin take 5 more years to make a sequel I don't care. I woulda wanted it done right. Like I said though, too little, too late. What's done is done, we all gotta leave it alone. Myself included. As for speaking of 3 films, I feel very much like Arsh does. He pretty much said it all for me.

 

~Raf~

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TL, you think that Artisan cared too much about the '04 film? If they did they woulda gave Hensleigh a bigger budget than 15 million dollars don't you think? Movies that bombed have recieved over a hundred million dollars. I wished for sequel to Tom's version. Too little, too late. We can't live in the past cause if we do, we won't ever see a future. What's done is done. If it were up to me, I woulda sodl the rights of the character to a different production company and taken my time with it. Fuckin take 5 more years to make a sequel I don't care. I woulda wanted it done right. Like I said though, too little, too late. What's done is done, we all gotta leave it alone. Myself included. As for speaking of 3 films, I feel very much like Arsh does. He pretty much said it all for me.

 

~Raf~

 

Agreed.

 

If Artisan/Lions Gate cared about the '04 film, they would have given Hensleigh the money to film the Kuwait battle scene, as well as give the film more marketing and not make it go against KILL BILL 2

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Should The Mist not have been released on Thanksgiving because of Hitman?

 

Bahahaha... no offense, but... apparently not. When you release a movie has a big effect on how much money it makes, and that's the bottom line for the studio. Horror movies don't do well at Thanksgiving either. So, even being a critical success, the odds were against it doing well at the box office. I don't know who planned that release date but they should've bumped it back or moved it forward.

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Raffi, you're a mixed up kid. First of all, Hensleigh's Punisher (the TRUE Punisher film) cost $28 million - NOT $15. A "Bomb" is a film that performed poorly at the box office - NOT something that made a hundred mil. Finally, if Artisan and Hensleigh's wife Valhalla CEO Gale Anne Hurd "didn't" care about 2004's Punisher, it woulda gone straight to video - like most of Artisan's motion pictures. Films like Punisher and Saw led to the establishment of LGF which primarily focuses on theatrical releases.

 

The total budget was 28... but the actual budget for SHOOTING the movie was 15 after salaries and marketing... Travolta took a big chunk of it. And it did not make 100 million. 50 million world wide plus more on DVD

 

PLEASE don't talk about the Wolverine character and Hugh Jackman's take on him, if you're gonna use it as ammunition against me. It has NOTHING to do with the subject at hand. Feel free to disclose your opinion on the matter in the Woverine movie thread located in the Comics and Film forum.

 

He's highlighting your hypocrisy. He has every right to use that as an example. Don't blame him that you can't retaliate on that.

 

One more thing (more facts ya had wrong): Hugh Jackman is 6'3" - NOT 6'2". He weighs 220 lbs. at 7% body fat - NOT 180 lbs. If you were referring to the X1 Hugh Jackman, then yes he was near the 180 lbs. range.

 

Why the hell are you discussing the man's body anyway? What does that have to do with anything? What difference does an inch make?

 

Arsh, what the fuck are you talking about??? Kill Bill Vol. II??? What does that mean? You want the studio to give a shit about the competition now? Should The Mist not have been released on Thanksgiving because of Hitman? And WHY are you bringing up Tom Selleck? Are you saying Thomas Jane's Frank Castle is equivalent to what Selleck woulda done with Indiana Jones?

 

If that is your sentiment for Thomas Jane Arsh, REMEMBER who's Board you are in. Absolutely no respect for his work as Frank.

 

You know, I am trying my best to be civil, but you make it really, really difficult for me.

 

The spot for the 04 film against KB2 was an idiotic mistake. Had the Punisher been released against competition of that magnitude (it was highly anticipated sequel to KB, remember?), it coulda made another 20, 30 million easily.

 

I brought up Sellick as another example to highlight the fact that you were WRONG. Harrison Ford was not the first person cast as Indy, and had CBS not wanted to keep Selleck, it would have been Selleck as Indiana Jones.

 

And how is that an insult against Tom? You're looking for things that aren't there. I thought Tom preformed admirable in the 04 movie... just about EVERY SINGLE PUNISHER FAN ON THE PLANET, thought he did a great job. I'm not comparing Selleck to Tom. Again, you're looking for things that aren't there.

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I'm referring to the company who gives the money to the production. Hensleigh faught for a bit more than 15 or 28...I heard they got 30 million at one point and then it was actually 15 million....either way, it's a small ass budget for an action film. We all know that Hensleigh and his staff cared a great deal about the movie. Their superiors however didn't cause if they did, they woulda fished out at least 60 mil like how a pretty decent action movie would get. Some of them are up to 90. Then you have Transformers and Spider-Man who get well over a 100 million for a budget. When I said "bombed" I mean movies that were given a budget of 100 million dollars have bombed at the box office. I can't think of any off the top of my head but I know there are a few if not many of them out there. I didn't mean that there are movies out there that have scored over a 100 million dollars at the box office and bombed. That rarely happens. If they score over a 100 mil at the box office it's because of the name. For example, Spider-Man 3. Nowhere near the best of the 3 but still scored high because of the name. I'm just sayin.

 

As for Hugh Jackman's take on Wolverine....Okay he's 6'3, I was off an inch my bad. When I said he was 180 I was talkin about when they casted him. He was nearly a beanpole. I believe it has a lot to do with the subject at hand if you are comparing and contrasting the actors who play the Punisher from comic to film. Punisher board or not, it's an example.

 

We all have nothing but the most respect for Tom and what he did for Frank. We all felt for him after that letter he posted about why he left and how he felt. What can we do now? Nothing. We all can't keep complaining about how he's the best and how this film won't work or how it's gonna suck. We all lose if this is the case. If it makes everyone feel better by complaining then by all means everyone go for pro.

 

Raff

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Arsh, WHY the fuck are you replying to my response to RAFFI'S posts??? Are you Arsh or Raffi? And I never said the film made a hundred mil - it made $34 million domestically. NOT $50.

 

Now, stop speaking of civility - don't think I feel fuckin cool with you callin me a hypocrite. Keep trying to deny your treason to TJ's Frank - the Selleck post ain't going anywhere.

 

Arsh, are you one of those people that has never been a part of somethin? That has never displayed loyalty to anything? If that's the case, then I know what I'm up against: An Army of people like you, that have zero respect for the TRUE Punisher film. You'll remember the garbage you were fighting for tonight, when that same garbage goes straight to the shitter in September. Mark my words.

 

Raffi, Jackman's Wolverine IS an example - but be careful how you throw it at me (reference my warning to Arsh).

 

And when fighting for a cause that's pure and true, there is no losing.

 

-TL

 

IT'S A MOVIE, YOU CRAZY BASTARD! WHAT TREASON!? THERE ISN'T A WAR! WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT!?

 

Never been a part of something? Never shown loyalty? You don't know a goddamn thing about me. So shut your fucking mouth before you even think you can understand me.

 

The world doesn't live in absolutes, Logan. It's just you.

 

You know... now that I think about it.

 

I think you're faking all this crap... no one talks like this. Just way to over the top.

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That temper of yours won't get you anywhere around here.

 

The same goes for your paranoia and insanity.

 

Whether War Zone is a success or not, it's not up to me. All I can do is remain optimistic and hopeful that it comes out right, and so far from what I've seen, it's coming along just fine. I can accept the chance that it might suck. I hope it won't, but you never know. But you on the other hand... you've become so wrapped up in your own rhetoric that you can't accept anything else but your own opinion and it is maddening.

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Guest AdminGuyX

TL, how do you know Hugh Jackman has 7% body fat? Is this published on his website or in some kind of athletic magazine or something? I'm not knocking you for knowing that, I'm just curious where a person could learn such a thing.

 

And if anybody is interested, the official Marvel.com bio lists The Punisher at 6' 1" tall. 200lbs with black hair and blue eyes. And who knew this little tidbit? Not me

 

listed in Marine records as a deserter

 

That's right off the marvel website. I guess I missed that storyline. Is he part of the A-Team too?

 

TL, I respect that you're fixated on Tom as Frank, and given where we are I understand you might be trying to impress him, because hey, obviously he's reading this, but every film is an attempt to make money. The Punisher was no exception. It's the movie business my friend. Every film is about making money.

 

Tom is a rarity in the industry to be sure, and not just because he is obviously a good friend who keeps his promises (just ask that 3-D Ray fellow) but also because he isn't afraid to take big risks. He went into the role knowing who the character was because he knows comics. He left the role because it was the right thing for him to do. He didn't sell out. It clearly meant something to him both times.

 

That's admirable, and you admire him, and I can tell, a great deal. From what I have read of Hugh Jackman, another person you clearly admire, he also seems like a good person, a good father, and there can be no question he's a world class thespian.

 

You could find worse role models in life.

 

I guess I'm just trying to put your point of view into words that are less confrontational to some of the other posters, because you keep things interesting around here, and I'd hate to see this thread devolve again.

 

I don't think anybody feels they are being traitorous or disloyal to Tom Jane by being open to Ray's work on War Zone, and I doubt they admire him any less because he walked away.

 

Hope that makes sense!

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Guys, I know it's hard but you gotta try and keep it together here.

I say TL is entitled to his opinion, and I don't feel it's necesarry to wage a war here.

He's dead set against the new film because he admires the 2004 version, Jane's performance, etc.

Fair enough. But, please, if these guys want a chance to explore and even enjoy this new take please do not rank on them for it. We know where you stand and there are many who would applaud you for your loyalty. One thing I can't jibe with is a flat out effort to make someone feel like an idiot or a traitor if they want to move on with the new film.

Efforting to push that on folks seems futile to me.

Neither can I abide repeated needling the opposite way. Stop taking personal shots.

My final warning on this subject. I want you ALL here. Disagreements are a part of the landscape.

Agree to disagree.

 

Noeland put the right spin on this whole thing and TL is playing nice.

Everyone else please follow suit.

We're passionate people, that's mondo cool.

This ain't Roe VS Wade though.

 

Thanks people.

- Tb

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Tim thanks for stepping in before things got completely out of hand. In general I mean. Not towards anyone personally.

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Noeland, I respect your view and thank you for for your praise on my involvement in this thread. The mags I buy monthly are Flex, Muscle & Fitness and Wrestling Illustrated - they all have constant updates on Hugh's revolutionizing dedication to the Wolverine character through Bodybuilding. Those same mags also provided coverage on TJ's training and final results for his role as Frank.

 

But to be honest with you, the magazines were only a check-sheet for me. I got my degree in Personal Fitness over a year ago, and did my first regional show last May. I came in 8th place, 181 lbs. at 6% body fat (I'm 5'10"). I spot body fat and body weight miles away.

 

-TL

 

Sheesh, the mags I buy every month are Bon Appetite and High Times.

Must explain my dainty figure ;)

 

- tb

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Ever see my cover to Gangland #1?

 

Gangland1.jpg

 

With trade dress -

Gangland1td.jpg

 

We actually did an additional half cover which was the door to the left stall.

Had to cover the blood up so we could print it. Hilarious.

 

My favorite part is what you don't see. The assassin having to get up with his pants around his ankles to retrieve the full roll of TP from the other stall. Incidentally we called this guy "the hard luck hitman". He made an appearance on the TPB in a different scene. Then he showed back up in Punisher Max. At the risk of going way off topic I'll post them next.

 

- TB

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My favorite part is what you don't see. The assassin having to get up with his pants around his ankles to retrieve the full roll of TP from the other stall. Incidentally we called this guy "the hard luck hitman". He made an appearance on the TPB in a different scene. Then he showed back up in Punisher Max. At the risk of going way off topic I'll post them next.

 

You talking about this guy?

 

pun_max_cover_08.jpg

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Here are the other two.

 

Biggest shot I could find. Don't have a scan of this for some reason. The liscense plate is in honor of my dad, who is lying in the trunk ;)

515KSMJM96L_SS500_.jpg

 

From Punisher Max 8.

PunM8f.jpg

 

I crossed comic companies with the character but me and Axel took him to Marvel ;)

Ack! Arsh beat me to half of it!

- Tb

 

PS - Now back to your original topic!

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